For the record, I ask because I do not understand, I don’t mean to offend anyone, specially people who are pro China.
I’m a native, which means I can read local news reports of course. From time to time I can find official articles about how someone got administrative fine due to using VPN. These are published by the PSB from various cities so I don’t doubt they are true.
Meanwhile, every post for China traveling on reddit would tell you to buy a VPN before you go. So I’m a bit surprised how an illegal behavior is practiced on such a huge scale. It seems the foreigners choose to ignore the elephant in the room.
Do you really think the government doesn’t know that foreigners all have VPNs on their phones? If they wanted to stop people from using them, they could do it quite easily. They already DO it quite easily, at “sensitive” times.
Government units as low as local police know that foreigners use VPNs, given that I’ve been told myself “we know foreigners use VPNs, please don’t discuss anything you see on the internet using your VPN with Chinese people”.
It’s a non-issue unless you’re selling/sharing.
As a native Chinese people, despite having access (from wherever you are, or using a VPN yourself), if you’re so shocked that people would want to circumvent the Great Firewall, then you yourself should be respectful of the spirit of that law, and even when abroad, you should avoid websites which are not in line with the Party’s mandate. Hence my question, why are you using Reddit?
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VPN are not illegal in China. Companies even Chinese ones use VPN every day. However that have to be registered (ICP filing) with MIIT.
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Astrill or Letsvpn for example are not registered, so yes they are probably illegal.
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Shadowsocks isnt a VPN. Not sure it requires an ICP filing.
And last point, even if a VPN is legal, it doesnt make what you do with it legal.
The main arrests for VPN possession are either
- An add-on charge to a bunch of other violations to make it even worse
- Selling personal VPNs
Granted I lived and worked in Shanghai + Beijing at multi-national corporations but 100% of my Chinese friends had VPNs to watch Netflix and get on Instagram to follow their favorite foreign celebrities.
All my native chinese friends have a type of vpn on their phone lol
everyone bypasses the firewall.
its normal.
so why worry about it?
If they strictly enforced the VPN ban, China would be officially worse than North Korea. And I would never go back to China again. I hate having to use VPN at all, it’s the single most shittiest thing about China.
according to Chinese constitution, freedom of speech, freedom to assemble and freedom to religion is a enshrined human rights, protected by Chinese gov. So what is legal and illegal is not so black and white in China
Most companies and universities offer vpns as a means to access their cloud in remote areas. Lots of things are illegal, just whether or not it’s enforced or if people use it to do harm. If you’re a local Chinese using a vpn to spread government hate speech and incite societal chaos, be ready to be punished. If you’re using a vpn to browse pussy videos (both) they won’t care.
The law in china is secondary. People are prosecuted when it’s convenient for the party. Think 寻衅滋事 (looking for quarrels and invoking trouble). There is no rule of law in china, only rule by law.
It’s convenient for the government to be able to prosecute citizens using vpns, but I’ve never heard of a foreigner getting in trouble for using one privately.
Police only targets people who sell VPN in China to Chinese consumers. Every foreigner in China has a VPN and many have their wifi router set up with VPN too. Never heard if anyone getting in trouble for it. Seems like the gov mostly care if native Chinese are using VPN, but even then many have one.
It seems VPN laws are selectively enforced. But I’ve never heard of a foreigner getting in trouble for a VPN unless they are doing something else illegal online, so this can be read as tacit approval. I work in a Chinese research institute with no institutional VPN and everyone has they’re own. The institute has even asked for printouts of Google scholar profiles, which you need a VPN to get. Its so absurd that it’s hard (for a foreigner) to take it seriously. Let alone it’s difficult to stay in touch with family and friends abroad without one.
我感觉挺可悲的，你一个能上reddit的native，能看中国新闻，还相信中国新闻，还来reddit问😂挺搞笑和自相矛盾的。中国限制网络只不过是表一下态度，现在国内翻墙的中国人比来中国翻墙的外国人要多很多，在中国的外国人才多少，你去查查有多少中国人翻墙，有多少管了，别的都不用多看，你就去下载个需要翻墙的交友软件，看看你附近呜呜泱泱的全都是中国翻墙用的人，而且大部分都是有留洋经验的。你看到几条中国新闻，就觉得中国在大肆抓翻墙行为了？中国新闻有指向性目的性的你不会不知道，这种新闻只不过是表态用的，没实际意义。我们清华这边的外国留学生都是允许使用的、直接可以用学校wifi连接，老师都会明里暗里点你，什么能做什么不能做。中国说vpn违法，只不过是设置一道如果出事可以用来定罪的条款，属于保险机制，和寻衅滋事一样，平时都是不管，真有人step on a nerve 才会用这个法律去“合法”处理，要像你说的那么违法，清华这些学生天天挂着vpn刷ins骂共产党，不早就遣返了？中国有关部门都清楚得很，只不过是没必要管，哈哈哈。 你所说的illegal是一个非常模糊不明的概念，打个极端的比方，卖毒品违法吧，中国就不可能允许有公司还能去申请卖毒品合格证，还允许大家手机上有毒品购买软件，你想想为什么vpn这个“违法”的东西公司都可以申请，个人还可以轻松的随便去下载软件去翻墙。很多大公司用的都是astrill vpn，我个人用的也是astrill，几百美金就能买两年会员。你不能拿中国人口说事，还想拿翻墙人口去和总人口做对比，来证明都是外国人在翻墙。你动动脑子，别说翻墙了，你就说杀人放火，你去拿杀人放火的罪犯人数和中国总人口对比也是个很小的概率、所以按照你的逻辑，在中国杀人放火的也都大部分是外国人😂我就没见过r/beijing评论区这么和谐反对一个人的，你懂了吧。
大家给你解释的很清楚了，在中国未经允许私自售卖，组织vpn的使用是违法的，个人使用vpn违法不违法是很模糊的一件事，我所有设备24小时连着astrill，去公安局办手续我都连着，要那么违法的话，我早进去了，都连了几年了，线上线下天天骂共产党。
how did you make this post if you don’t use a VPN? Can’t you answer this question yourself?
I suspect the locals who are penalized for using VPNS are activists of some kind.
We all know that China enforces the law selectively and arbitrarily with a heavy dose of guanxi thrown in.
Many of the VPNs and strategies are provided by Chinese people. The people that you see get in trouble are mostly Chinese (and a few foreigners ) who also did something else to bring the attention of the PSB. The existence of the firewall itself is primarily a form of protectionism to allow Chinese tech companies to be more successful. It is frequently breached to support other Chinese businesses and society. Educated Chinese people crossing the firewall isn’t really a concern that they have.
I’m somewhat suspicious of the truth of your post here — you mention foreigners as culprits but seem to ignore that EVERY Chinese company that does international business uses a VPN? Surely that’s a much more relevant question if you are a Chinese national?
It’s the same as all the police officers in the 派出所 smoking cigarettes under big ‘NO SMOKING’ signs.
It’s not a real rule.
I worked for a Chinese state media company for several years in Beijing. They use Astrill (yes, Astrill) every day to post their news on Facebook, Twitter/X, etc.
It’s clearly a self-serving thought-crime established and enforced by a dictatorship, so I ignore it. Establishing something as a crime does not necessarily mean that everyone stops doing it, it establishes the punishment should someone be caught breaking that law.